Fight Your Speeding Ticket With Simple Math
December 10th, 2007 Posted in Speed Limits, Traffic Tickets
Many speeding tickets are issued as the result of motorists being clocked with devices that measure how fast a vehicle covers a known distance.
Because some judges and district attorneys are not comfortable with mathematical calculations it is important for the well-prepared defendant to present mathematical based arguments in the simplest of terms. We will start from the end and work backwards.
A vehicle moving one mile per hour will cover 1.47 feet in one second.
If you wish to determine how far a vehicle will travel at a specific speed just multiply that speed by 1.47 feet. For example, if a vehicle is traveling 60 mph it will cover 88 feet in one second. Obviously, it will cover 176 feet in two seconds, etc.
If you are trying to determine how many seconds it would take a vehicle to cover a known distance at a specific speed just divide the distance by the speed and divide the result by 1.47 feet.
This will yield the number of seconds it would take the vehicle to cover a known distance at a known speed.
For example: A vehicle traveling 60 mph will cover 300 feet in 3.4 seconds—-300 divided by 60 divided by 1.47 = 3.4 seconds. If need be you can verify this calculation by multiplying 3.4 seconds times 88 feet (the distance traveled in one second at 60 mph) and the result brings you back to 300 feet.
If you are challenged on the validity of the 1.47 feet per second figure you can prove its validity in very simple terms.
- There are 5280 feet in one mile so a vehicle traveling one mile per hour will cover 5280 feet.
- There are 60 minutes in one hour so a vehicle traveling one mile per hour will travel 1/60th of that distance in one minute, or 88 feet.
- There are 60 seconds in one minute so a vehicle traveling at one mile per hour will cover 1/60th of the distance it covered in one minute, or 1.47 feet.
You could also state that there are 3600 seconds in one hour and divide that number into 5280 feet and the result would be the same, 1.47 feet.
Once the court accepts and understands the source of these numbers you can apply them to your defense.
If you receive a VASCAR ticket you should obtain a description of the distance over which you were clocked, the time it took your vehicle to cover that distance and the speed you are charged with traveling.
If the citation or incident report claims you covered 300 feet in 4.2 seconds and you are being charged with speeding at 60 mph in a 50 mph zone you can readily verify the accuracy, or lack thereof in this case, of the speed you were claimed to be traveling.
At 60 mph you would have traveled 370 feet, not 300 feet. However, at 50 mph you would have traveled 309 feet in 4.2 seconds, indicating that you were driving within the speed limit.
Even if the calculations indicated the error was in the opposite direction, that your speed was underestimated, the speed-reading should not be allowed as evidence against you, thus eliminating the prosecutions principal evidence against you.
In other cases involving radar or pacing, time over distance calculations can prove serious inconsistencies in the officer’s testimony.
If the officer testifies that he clocked your vehicle for 5 seconds and you were going 80 mph, you can prove, by using time over distance calculations, that the officer could not have seen you for more than two seconds, because of a curve or sign, if you had been traveling 80 miles per hour.
For more advice on how to fight an unfair speeding ticket, consider joining the NMA.
Image Credit: JonOakley
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I was in the southbound lane and was clocked by a cop traveling in the northbound lane with a 30 foot median between us. How was he able to clock my speed?
Edwin,
Im not sure about NYC laws but in my state we are not allowed to lock in speeds and do not have to show the driver the speed. The reason we arent allowed to lock the speeds is because officers were locking it and keeping it for other drivers to give tickets. Its a pain that they sit at the change of speed limits but thats probably what their told to do and unfortunately there are some ticket junky cops out there. I for one am not one of them.
A vehicle traveling at 1 miles per hour will cover 1.466666667feet each second DO NOT make the same mistake that the NMA has and ROUND OFF to the higher 1.47ft as this would render a measurable mistake in your calculation. For example a vehicle traveling 60 mph covers 88 feet per second. If you calculated using the 1.47 figure in your the results will have an error of .2ft/sec or velocity of 88.2 ft/sec. A .2ft error is roughly 2.4″ over 88ft. Instead of rounding off as the NMA did you should truncate to the 4th decimal place reducing the error of your calculations to .048″ or approx 3/64th of an inch over that same 88ft distance.
i was going at speed limit 35 in the holland tunnel in nyc, the minute you come out the speed changes to 25, the office stands right at the outside of the tunnel in a parking lot and gives me a ticket for 45 mph. i know i wasnt going beyond its limit when i came out i did not stop because the lights were green, there were other vehicles moving along side,
when the offficer came to me i asked him to show me the readings and he only flashed the laser on my eye sight, it read 45, also below hat what i thought was the time 12:52 , now it was 1:15 when i got the ticket. quetion, does the time gets displayed on the face or was this from a previous reading, can the displayed speed stay there. i have pleaded guilty already through a lawyer, i just felt defenseless, and i did not know if i counted with enough defense on my part. i liked your article, here.
I don’t know if any of you read my post on march 10, but ya.. So on my ticket, it says Court Date: 4/04/09, which is today. I go to court, no one is there, I asked one of the officers sitting in the parking lot where everyone was and he said there is no court on saturdays, and he said the trooper was an idiot for writing me a ticket and giving me court on a saturday. So I don’t know what I should do, I think its the troopers fault for messing up and my ticket should be dropped or reduced, also thinking about completely ignoring it now because I dont have a set date.
You need to call the court and reschedule your appearance. You may if that State allows respond with a not guilty plea via the mail and the court will respond with a court date for you to appear. Simply not appearing can only result in something negative for you either an arrest Warrant or suspension of your driving priviledges.
I got pulled over at 1:23 am and was issued a $120 speeding ticket for going 52-40.
My license was suspended for a year for having 2 speeding tickets in one year. Will the suspend or revoke it again because of this speeding ticket?
That depends on how long ago your suspension was and how many points are still on your “current” record. Suspension for two speeding tix? Must have been going real fast to get enough points for a suspension.
The suspension was in 2007-2008. I got my license back Feb, 2009. so this would be my first speeding ticket in 2 years. that should make me all set right?
I guess that is up to the judge…getting one so soon after being “legal” again will surely come into play….plus in CO, points are compiled for 3 years, as well as the insurance DING.
In the few tix I’ve gotten, all were either too small to fight….many states away, and the twice I’ve been to court, points were greatly reduced. Hecque, I even got too close to a parked school bus and hit the mirror with my delivery truck, and broke the hood latch, knocking it onto the ground….For whatever reason, surely because that was my first ticket in many years, charged with “careless driving resulting in accident”, the judge reduced it to “driving unsafe equipment” and NO accident or moving violation.
WHEW!!!
Good luck.
Good news is I don’t think that g recieving 2 speeding citations in a year will have any effect on your license. Bad news is that driving on a suspended license at 52mph in a 40mph zone might work against you in getting your driving priviledges reinstated.
your math is wrong: at 60 y0u go 88 feet per sec, proofis :88 x60 =5280 ft. which is one mile DO THE MATH & DONT GIVE FALSE INFO> ( HEY ARE YOU A COP??? HMMMM)
Casey your best bet at beating a speeding ticket is to hire an attorney to fight it for you in court. This however, is very expensive. You can see if the prosecutor will take a plea deal for something not in the moving category like a broken or inaccurate speedometer.
I just got pulled over the other day 80/55. I was driving on the expressway and going under an overpass which was perpendicular to the expressway. The cop apparently saw me on the bridge over the expressway which doesnt make sense to me. He didn’t turn his lights on or do anything until I got onto my street. He said i was going about 80, he never verified a certain speed but put down 80 on my ticket.
My ticket says Charge based on officer’s direct observation and speed verified by radar. This would be my second speeding ticket, I normally wouldn’t fight it but when he came up to my car and never gave me a certain speed i don’t know if I should?
I would like to join if I know you can help with a failure to use a turn signal violation. If think you can help then let me know and I will join.
I love the site I do want to remind people in early 80’s we were told the were camera everywhere in Russia. I did travel there in 1983 and was given a prize tour for a 20 year old. I did see some camera at intersections in Saint Petersburg and i was told there to keep people in order. Looking back now and seeing what I see on our streets and cameras that the goverment is watching. We are looking like Russia in 1983. Welcome to USA where you had freedoms, liberty, justice right to pursue or something like that. Now where control like rats in a maze you have to follow a leader go astray and you will end up in jail, broke, killed by the USA. Let follow what Tommy Chong said Vote these asshole out of office and find who was accountable and use the freedom of information act. Or just the course we are going and become Communist State of America. This just my observation oh and where I see speed camera or red light camera. I dont go that way and tell the business I stop going there and found a better place where the government is not watching me. Economic boycott work watch how quickly that will clear up and maybe officer will patrol the street and set a example ( but they violate and there boss cover there ass). Remember when you see a cop shopping take a camera picture if you can, note the time and date. And ask the local station if there was any activity going on there and what are my tax dollars going to pay someone to shop. It is the responsibilty of a person driving a government vehicle to be accountable for all place he stops and why. Lets put a law on Government vehicles be listed in the newspaper of every account where they went. And if you see them speeding meaning they passed you while you were obey the law what was the emergency. I thought when you turn the emergency lights you pull to the side and let the officer pass by with the emergency he is going to and no exceptions for going over the limit. If you do see a government vehicle speeding if you can jot down his tag number do speed up because you would violating. keep going the speed limit he will have to stop at a light than jot down his number, right down the hundred block, direction (westbound) the time, the weather condition, posted speed limit, and be honest to speed you were going. And say he raced by and no emergency were on, no terrorist attacks, no real emergency you know about. Get the rule books to your jurisidication and see whatever cause they can use and make sure you can prove it was not emergency and he was disobeying the law. I also think it you have time and can hangout where a camera device is bring your video camera and record when the flash happens and a goverment car goes by slamdunk all the evidence you need and the laws will change or Communism-Socialism. Group togther and take action in a civil way. Remember we are paying for the people whom protect us and we can vote the bosses out and elect someone who is accountable for himself, community and where the money goes that is being spent by our tax dollars. Remember let business know you not going that way anymore and why you think and that business might help change this ridiculous way to get all of earned money. BE SAFE AND PRAY FOR THIS REFORM AND LET ALL OF THE PEOPLE ELECTED IN YOUR DISTRICT YOU MEAN WHAT YOU SAY AND CHANGE WILL HAPPEN OR THEY WILL BE UNEMPLOYED. I could go on forever I was once a aide to a presidential appointee and learned a little how the government. Please Have a good day and be proud of yourself and your achievements
@ Sam – Why not put up a fight for a speeding ticket that you didn’t really deserve in the first place?
At some point in time, speeding tickets can be defended. While a majority of speeding tickets should be given to those who obviously deserved them (i.e. doing 100 in a 70 MPH zone), there are times that tickets, such as doing 67 in a 65 or similar, shouldn’t be given.
Trust me, I’ve received dumb tickets like that, and had no clue how to fight them, so like a dummy, I paid the fine, when I easily could’ve fought it.
By jared Eckert on Jan 22, 2009
Does anyone know the average speeding ticket cost, in colorado, for going 20mph over? i was going 55 (according to the cop) in a 35. i got 6 points and a $237 fine. Was my first traffic violation ever. does this sound about right?>>
I ’spose it depends on the jurisdiction. My last ticket 4.5 yr ago was in Denver 80 in a 55 on I-70 and it cost my $176, but I had NO priors….fine wasn’t reduced but the points were reduced to 3. did you go to court?
Amazing, a couple of years earlier I was driving the company delivery truck to deliver large equipment to a school and miscalculated the size on a narrow street and removed the mirror and smashed the hood of a school bus.
Because of my good driving record, the fine was reduced to $50, and NOT…unbelievably, NOT charged with an accident, even though the insurance paid $1500 for the bus and who knows for the phoney female driver who claimed “injuries” way after the fact, and had a long history of these types of “injury claims”.
My son nailed by a County Mounty in WYO and was $300 for 7 mph over in a work zone, even though it was at 9 at night and no workers were there.
You could probably make a million dollars if you could figure out any kind of sanity to the penalties imposed by states, counties, cities, jurisdictions….
Wife got one 47 in a 30, fine was $75, but because of her good record, reduced to 0 points, “unsafe equipment”, but the $$$ remained the same…speed trap town of Morrison.
By jared Eckert on Jan 22, 2009
Does anyone know the average speeding ticket cost, in colorado, for going 20mph over? i was going 55 (according to the cop) in a 35. i got 6 points and a $237 fine. Was my first traffic violation ever. does this sound about right?>>
All laws are different and 20 over can be considered a felony especially in a residential zone im guessing since the limit was 35. I would take it to court and see if the judge will give you a lesser penalty since its your first violation. Most judges are reasonable. But i work in MD so i dont know CO laws.
Does anyone know the average speeding ticket cost, in colorado, for going 20mph over? i was going 55 (according to the cop) in a 35. i got 6 points and a $237 fine. Was my first traffic violation ever. does this sound about right?
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REF: You will learn that traffic enforcement is not about justice, nor is it about truth, but only processing as many cases as possible to assure the flow of money. Good luck.
Municipalities get about $17 from a citation. They get MORE out of parking tickets! So, get a clue.
OMG.
Nonsense. Fight every ticket, guilty or not because it takes the profit out of the process and most importantly sends a message that we citizens won’t be walked on.
Oh, Yeh. don’t listen to this idiot called Woodman below. He obviously is trying to make some money.
DO NOT bother fighting a ticket. Suck it up and pay fine. If you fight it in court you will end up paying a LOT more $$$$$. There is very little chance you will win.
If for some reason the planets aligned and the officer was wrong – tough sh^%$. Breaking traffic laws causes damage to property and lives. If you got dinged and did not violate the law – consider it taking one for the team. The $75.00 you contribute will help save a life.
How can you POSSIBLY say that? What’s wrong is wrong!!! I recently received a ticket 61/50 in an area that I KNOW to be a speed trap and NEVER speed in. I ALWAYS use my cruise control (’08 Buick Enclave) and definitely was that day as well. I’ll be dog-gonned if I will EVER admit to doing something, especially speeding, if I know for a fact that I was not! Why should my record be tarnished because the officer & the local parish want to get money that they do not deserve? I am more than capable for standing up for myself in a court of law, as I have a background in law and uncle who is a retired judge. I do not lie, and I dare them to question MY integrity! As for you – GET A LIFE!!!
I beat my ticket with a simple little book online. Now I am telling everyone about it. The book is HOT!! cost me 29 bucks (best money I ever spent) and saved me the price of my ticket and points on my license (saved me an insurance increase too) Unbelievable techniques gave me quite a few options to win in court. Fight the Money Grab! 2-clix.com/speed-trap . Let me know how it works out for you and good luck!
oh yeah, the book is USA ONLY. All states covered. I’m a carpenter living in NY (i do a lot of driving) so the plan worked for me. Pretty sweet! Not sure about it working in other states tho.
Sometimes….speed happens!
To Tiffany:
Never ever just pay a ticket. I know it’s a pain, but you should contest every ticket you get. You are very likely to get dismissals because the courts & the police really just don’t have time & funds for trials. At least request something called “differed adjudication” if you cannot bring yourself to go to trial. This is something only the judge or the DA can offer you. With differed adjudication you basically do not get any tickets for a predetermined period, pay a court fee & your ticket is dismissed. I would rather go to trial with a lawyer & make the cop who wrote the ticket look forgetful & incompetent, & win the case, but that is expensive. The legal defense kit that James Young suggested is an excellent idea.
Never ever ever just admit guilt. Exercise your right to a jury trial any time you are accused of anything, or at least try to work something out with the court without getting a conviction & points on your driving record.
Tiffany:
Join the NMA, host of this site. Call and ask them about renting the Legal Defense Kit, a collection of works that are useful in developing your defense. Be sure to plead not guilty and request a jury trial and then get as many deferrals from the court as possible by telling them – if they ask – that you are developing your legal strategy, which is the truth. Keep extensive notes, especially of conversations with court clerks, bailiffs, judges, prosecuting attorneys, LEOs, etc. They have a tendency to “forget” things unless it helps them. In 1986 I had an assistant DA lie straight to me. I won the case a year later but it caused lots of trouble. Several years later I got my revenge when I moved a business with a multi-million dollar payroll out of that state and since then I have let every governor know about it.
You will learn that traffic enforcement is not about justice, nor is it about truth, but only processing as many cases as possible to assure the flow of money. Good luck.
To Tiffany
Tiffany I know that police can be very unfair (not all police are unfair) and I know it must be stressful dealing with 2 tickets within such a short period of time. Anyway if it’s just a $150 fine then just pay it but if it will include points to your driver’s license, and increase insurance rates then I would say to take it to court.
Tiffany I tried my best to give you the advice in which I aready know. I’m sorry if its not the advice you wanted. I hope everything works out fine.
Oh and I forgot to say one thing which is that if you are going to fight it in court you MUST plead Not guilty (Warning: Thats just my advice and I don’t know if that is appropiate for your circumstance so please check with someone else who you can trust to give you advice). Every state laws are different.
Can anyone else on this web site give Tiffany good advice for her PLEASE!!!
Oh and prior to these two tickets, I’ve had a clean record for a bit over a year and a half of driving. It’s just the ending of November wasn’t my month I suppose. One more note, my court appearance is on December 30th, in a few weeks a little after Christmas and before New Years Eve. I’ve been contemplating fighting this by showing up to court? But I’m not sure if I should get an extension or if I walk into court, what am I supposed to do… =\ help! I feel so lost.
Hi,
I recently got a highway ticket that costs 150? I’ve already used my traffic school this month for a ticket I got a few weeks before this one. Here’s what happened:
I just got onto the freeway early morning on my way to school. I was still on the far right lane where you just get on the freeway and there was some traffic so I couldn’t get over to the left lane right away. Driving about 35-40 miles in the furthest right lane, I signaled over and there was a cop in front of me who had just done the same. Once he was able to get over, I hesitated just because he was a cop but I doubled checked to see if it was safe to get over. Once I got over to the left lane over, the cop pulls over, lets me go in front, then pulls me over. He explained that the lane I was in before I signaled over had a sign that said “Right Lane Must Exit”.. but he did the same about 3-4 seconds before I did… I was near the exit still trying to get over the whole time since I just got on but couldn’t because of traffic. He claimed that I crossed the “V” point where the lane splits into an exit, but I’m pretty sure I was at least 2-3 feet away from it though I was close. Is there anyway I can fight this case? If so, how do I fight it?
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Uhm, Crush, I think you and so many others ought to be given a RESPONSIBILITY test to see if you qualify to drive. One must ALWAYS accept the RESPONSIBILITY for ones actions, and speeding just because YOU think the limit is unfair is NOT being responsible.
I’ve seen more cases in Colorado where the speed limit had been raised from the prior limit than the other way around. And buddy, here, anyway, they DO take into account the highway conditions, traffic volume, number of side road intersections, etc., and even radar check the “natural speeds”, that is what the general traffic is traveling, to set those limits.
Sure, there are podunk little towns like Morrison who have NO sales tax income, so rely on traffic tickets for revenue. So you obey their preposterous limits rather than FIGHTING them, and you’ll be just fine.
Oh, and driving is not a “right”, it is a privilege which can be taken away thru the due process if you don’t respect that privilege and the laws, whether YOU personally agree with them or not. Your “RIGHT” is to be able to fight a ticket in a court of law, and golly gee….the judge just may NOT agree with YOU and you may just learn the difference between a “privilege” and a “right”.
DeepCrush I suppose you also have the right to kill someone if your 20 mph or 30 mph over the limit contributes to killing someone? Are you going to let the guy off doing 30 mph over the limit if he kills someone? I guess he must have been traveling too fast then.
“DeepCrush I suppose you also have the right to kill someone if your 20 mph or 30 mph over the limit contributes to killing someone? Are you going to let the guy off doing 30 mph over the limit if he kills someone? I guess he must have been traveling too fast then.”
News flash, people don’t just kill over dead if your driving over the speed limit. No one says you should drive recklessly, and that all depends on the driver. This country should learn to spend more money and effort in training better drivers than lining their pockets with speeding ticket dollars. Its a multi billion dollar business which they are addicted to, and it needs to be stopped. Stop spending millions on fancy new race cars for cops and high tech equipment they can employ behind the tree they are hiding behind, and start spending some money on training kids to drive better. They claim officers get all this high tech manuever training to help the in high speed chases, which is exactly the kind of training we should insist on for EVERYONE. Then at some point in the future you remove the required speed limits from the highways and only put up suggested speed signs, and you actually perform maintenance on the roads. Imagine that idea.
All the money spend on traffic cops patrolling the roads raping us all out of money could be spent making those cops patrol your neighborhoods. I would much rather have a cop on the corner of my street than hiding behind the burm on the highway. Of course I do know how to drive. I’ve sped my whole driving life, which is about 21 years. Spent thousands in tickets, and have had only one accident when I was 17 and someone hit ME. Stop giving licenses to pimple faced kids who know nothing more about driving than 10 and 2, and start training them.
I’m tired of seeing the morons out there with a death grip on their steering wheel with their seats so far forward they can lick their windshield, with this terrifying look on their face when I pass them. They are the dangerous ones out there. They are the ones killing people, because they are terrified of their car and the road. They have no confidence and freak out at the slightest change in front of them. End the madness. Remove the traffic cops and make them perform a real job that will benefit us all, and stop lagging up the court system with 100s of speeding ticket violations a day. Its rediculous.
It’s not immature to protest an unfair law.
If you were doing 60mph in 45mph speedzone it’s not a question of whether or not you are “guilty” accoring to the “law” if the law is unjust. Speed limits are not scientifically established based on parameters such as conditon of the roadway, weather, driver experience, traffic flow, vehicle condition etc..
Anyone who is accused of “speeding” if I am on a jury is going to get off scott free, unless he was obviously driving recklessly (ie. driving 120mph in a 35 or weaving excessively in and out of traffic etc..)
Don’t accept “sanction of the victim” and pay the fine even if you were going above the posted “speed limit”.. fight for your rights.
As a lawyer practicing traffic law in California for more than a decade I can attest to this simple, mathematical system for challenging speeding allegations. In fact, we coach this method in our self-defense course on http://www.trafficfighters.com
A GPS record of your location across time can also greatly help bolster your version of the events. The key is to use this math to determine what actually happened from your own recollection, and then get the testifying officer(s) to admit to facts (time, distance) that support your theory of the case during cross examination. Good luck!
Its 65 now, in MD anyway i mean im only 26 so i cant speak for before i started driving.
Officer Josh – why is the freeway speed limit in MD only 65? It used to be 70 prior to 1974.
John said:
It’s about money. Cities and states acrue allot of revenue via tickets and the way to handle this is not to get mad, but to get even. Everyticket you receive is redeamable for one NOT Guilty verdict the next time you serve on a jury. You will never see the other eleven people again and it costs the state a fortune, definitely more than your ticket, to re-try the case. The lost revenue cuts into the raises the police receive and upgrades to equipment required to do the job. When you are on a jury you have more power than anyone else in the courtroom INCLUDING the judge.
Use that power and spread the idea.
———–
Hmmmm… A misdirected use of jury nullification. A little on the overkill.
It does bother me though that speed limits were set along time ago before radial tires and anti-lock brakes,etc.. They have been kept artificially low in order to collect revenue. For instance in NYC there are no traffic courts instead you appear before an administrator who is required to to maintain 65% closer rate to fund the operation. Outside the city in a regular court if you show up the prosecutor usually drops the speed down to 10 over because the town gets the revenue. Above this number the revenue goes to the state so town courts drop the number down to keep the money local.It’s a scam.
Bottom line speed limits could raised an average of 20 mph across the board due to new technology in automobiles permiting safe driving at higher speeds. I’ve been driving fast for 30 years accident free and I drive in and out of Manhattan everyday. To me accidents are caused primeraly by drivers driving too slow..getting in the way, distractions, and fatigue.
As for John’s comment I guess it depends on when you get the ticket. If I were to get a six pointer on the way to or from jury duty, oh well:) If on the other hand its been along time then I wouldn’t take it into account.
John said: t’s about money. Cities and states acrue allot of revenue via tickets and the way to handle this is not to get mad, but to get even. Everyticket you receive is redeamable for one NOT Guilty verdict the next time you serve on a jury.
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That is one of the stupidest ideas I have ever heard. Totally disregard the fact, totally disregard guilt or innocence and instead act like a four year old throwing a temper tantrum.>>>
I totally agree. If you are guilty, then just fess up and pay up. Don’t tie up the courts along with all the defendants who have a LEGITIMATE GRIPE to fight whatever they are fighting in the courts. Wasting every body elses time and energy for your own pathetic selfish cause is just downright onerous to others.
I have personally went to court when I thought the officer was wrong, and have paid up when I was indeed guilty and got CAUGHT.
John said: t’s about money. Cities and states acrue allot of revenue via tickets and the way to handle this is not to get mad, but to get even. Everyticket you receive is redeamable for one NOT Guilty verdict the next time you serve on a jury.
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That is one of the stupidest ideas I have ever heard. Totally disregard the fact, totally disregard guilt or innocence and instead act like a four year old throwing a temper tantrum.
It’s about money. Cities and states acrue allot of revenue via tickets and the way to handle this is not to get mad, but to get even. Everyticket you receive is redeamable for one NOT Guilty verdict the next time you serve on a jury. You will never see the other eleven people again and it costs the state a fortune, definitely more than your ticket, to re-try the case. The lost revenue cuts into the raises the police receive and upgrades to equipment required to do the job. When you are on a jury you have more power than anyone else in the courtroom INCLUDING the judge.
Use that power and spread the idea.
Sorry Tony I did not see anything in that article that talked about unmarked cars. It talked about car color is the only thing that I saw.
Ok. I did say that he was speeding at 90mph when he cut me off.
But after that due to the traffic , he wasn’t able to go that fast. it was about 65-70mph (speed of traffic)
I flashed and honked..and he got scared and was taking the next exit.
Oh btw, according to california vehicle code a Traffic officer cannot give a traffic citation in a unmarked car.
http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d17/vc40800.htm
Well, you should be ok if you go to court then Tony. Thats why most police should use lidar instead of radar. It cuts on mistakes such ast that.
Josh,
I wasn’t speeding. Some retarded suv guy who was merging from 280 into 101 cut me off and i swerved from my lane into another lane for safety sake. I agree it really pissed me off to. So I followed that guy at his speed to note his license, but he took the next exit. When I was cut off, I had no time to turn on my turn signals. It was a split second, and I was taken aback. I tried to prevent an accident. Obviously this cop didn’t see that. And he wrote me a ticket for unsafe lane change. on his way to work on his unmarked car. I tried to explain to him, and he’s like “Say that in the court!!!”
What would you do if someone custs you off and you end up braking like crazy and he/she speed off at 90 miles an hour???
It’s a simple charge. But my insurance on my 3 cars and motorcyle will all be jacked up atleast $200 each per year for 3 years.
Now it’s going to cost me time and money, and stress to prove myself. And even if I win, the cop has no consequences. I lose time, money. I hate all of them.
Why can’t they mind their own busineess and do what they’re supposed to do (if you’re not a patrolling officer).
Sepcially if they see a nicer and powerful car, they discrimintae even more. Not to mention the racial stuff
Tony,
Were you actually speeding?
If you know that the ticket is going to raise your insurance with fines, Fight every ticket. I agree completely. BTW, Just for warning for folks in california. Recently I got pulled over by a unmarked cop car (like a beige ford taurus or something) in San Jose and the bastard gave me a ticket or speeding on the highway. As it’s going to affect my insuracne I’m fighting it myself using some good books (How to fight a ticket in california by David Brown – great book). However using lawyers , is not very feasible due to the cost and also lawyers who regularly fight for a county (they know the judges) and sometimes don’t want to fight anything thi simple that hard as they usually have to deal with judges for othe rcases. Lawyers never worked for me. They always eat your money unless you’re a real celebrity or they get some attention in the news.
Chris,
Your absolutely right, i am a police officer for the gov’t and recently caught 10 illegal aliens in a van with fake licenses and 10,000 dollars in cash on a traffic stop. When i notified my superior about what i found, he came out and we called INS or (immigration)and they told us that it wasnt enought people for them to come out and told us to let them go!!! Thats rediculous!!! we locked them up for having fake licenses and they served time and were released. Later on and INS investigator called me and started asking me about them (5 months later) and he wanted to know why we didnt call. I told him we did and you guys told us “it wasnt enough people” he was baffled. They really need to get themselves together and start setting some standards and SOP’s for there agency.
Fight every ticket ! Why are you just paying?
Does anyone know if the dollar amount per mile over the speed limit in Ga.varies with different counties? Was told by clerks office the fine is $84.00. Was going to pay on the net and it shows $104.00. Where would I find info. on how the fine was derived? Thanks
catherine:
Leo. Not to be confused with LEO.
Thank you for the kind words.
I just got through the first page and a half of this and think it is fab! I got a ticket today and the cop full out falsified information on it. I was so sad because one often has no recourse when dealing with shady types in positions of authority, and searching for info on crooked traffic cops, I found this site. James Young makes me smile. I think he’s a Virgo. I wish there were more people like that with the ability to use logic and facts rather than emotional regurgitations of what they were taught ‘The Law Is The LAw’ Les Miserables style. To be that patient in the face of all the bluster and blather, I’m envious. I find dealing with said Les Mis types so soul killing. Can’t wait to read more of it all but it’s so long! JAMES! VIRGO? Gemini? Hmm. AI? hehheh -A researcher who needs to know.
Billy Bob says “As an older wiser person than all of you here is how I handle the slow/fast crowd. I put ’student driver’ magnetic signs on my car and a ‘tophat’ made of yellow plastic that mounts magnetically to the roof that also says ’student driver’. Whalla! All you a-hole speedy gonzales types see that tophat a mile away so you switch over to the fast lane and zip right the heck by me. The other slow pokers line up right behind me.”
I thank you Billy Bob, what a great Idea. Why can’t we do the same thing to all the white knuckled two fisted nose on the steering wheel drivers out there? I mean I would like to know who are the ones who are scared out of their wits and which ones are comfortable enough to make a quick decision if need be. I want to be as far away from the those drivers as I can be since they are usually the ones swerving into the opposite lane and slamming on the breaks when a rabbit gets near the road or if another driver goes to pass them. You can see the fear on their face as they death grip the wheel. The highway is like a war zone to them.
I mean to think someone would be so scared they would put magnets all over their car in an attempt to keep everyone away from them except the other inexperienced drivers. Wow. If only they could make that law, or make you drive around in a car covered in neon lights or something. Or have you take a drivers course once a month or something.
Good post Joe,
I drive about 30,000 mi/year on interstate highways, and most unsafe acts or conditions I’ve observed have a single cause: lack of lane courtesy — i.e. failure to keep right unless passing.
Regardless of the speed limit or level of enforcement, not everyone is going to travel at the same speed. Safety is enhanced when drivers can reasonably predict what other drivers will do. Any time there’s a car in the middle or left lane that isn’t actively passing someone to their right, that predictability is lost and safety is compromised.
chris says: (its a fact that speed is a major contributing factor in a majority of crashes.) (And knowing my job means that I know from experience, fact and statistics in our area)
Easier said then backed up by facts. If you care to back up your statements lets see some of those REAL figures. You can find accident data all day long but when it comes to enforcement data where is it? How are we to know what enforcement works and what doesn’t? Why do municipalities almost never publish their enforcement data? Hiding something?
And how do you explain these articles;
Virginia Traffic Fatalities Hit 17-Year High. One thousand motorists died on Virginia roads despite crack downs on motorists and massive speeding ticket fines. http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/21/2148.asp
6/25/2008
Study: Higher Interstate Speed Limits are Safe
Purdue University study concludes raising the interstate speed limit in Indiana had no negative safety consequence. http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/24/2442.asp ….. just to post a quick couple of many on the Internet.
I recently had to take a “Human Factors” class required by the FAA. We were told that most accidents are the result of multiple factors. Guess that just doesn’t apply to terrestrial travel. Humans are “analog” creatures that don’t adapt well to the “digital” domain of your so worshiped “absolute” treatment of “the Law”. While I have no proof, I believe most legislators intend for their laws to be enforced “in the spirit of the law” and not absolutes.
That’s why you LEO’s have enforcement latitude. As James has eloquently explained small towns and the LEO’s that work for them in Oklahoma are the worst. But our bigger cites are catching up. It’s been proven clearly that their main goal is revenue.
The small town of Roland OK., not even visible from the Interstate, made over a million dollars in 2002 mostly assuredly for speeding violations. I believe they have about 5 miles of jurisdiction on I-40. If you travel in this area, beware.
And Chris, contrary to your mantra I doubt that all these citations had much effect on the accident rate which was probably very low to start with.